Robert Oakley and high level IRC officials visit Somaliland

 

argeisa (Rep)- A high level delegation from the International Rescue Committee (IRC) an American NGO working in Somaliland arrived in Hargeisa on Monday. Robert Oakley who served as the US ambassador in the former Somalia during 1982-1984 had also spearheaded the US led humanitarian military intervention in Somalia under Operation Restore Hope during Dec 1992. Somaliland President Egal received the IRC delegation on Monday evening in the presidential palace. Later in the evening Oakley and his colleagues were invited to dinner with Egal and a number of his cabinet ministers including foreign minister Mohmud S. Nur (Fagadhe). Robert Oakley is a member of IRC Board of Directors. The IRC delegation also included its vice president George Biddle who is in-charge of world-wide operations. The IRC has been operating in Somaliland for the last 6 years. It primarily works in agriculture and income-generating projects.  The IRC has been active in the 3 regions of Awdal, Hargiesa and Sahil. The IRC left Hargeisa on Wednesday heading for Kenya and southern Sudan. During their 2-day stay to Somaliland, the delegation visited a number of projects implemented with IRC funding. In an exclusive interview he gave to the Republican and Jamhuriya Mr. Oakley said he was very impressed with what he has seen in Somaliland. He also promised to recommend incremental aid to Somaliland after returning to the US. Excerpts of the interview appear in this issue.

 

Interview with Robert Oakley, former US Ambassador to Somalia.

Q- After what happened in Mogadisho during the UNOSOM a great number of American officials still keep holding grudges against all Somalis regardless of who took part in the bloody incidents of 1993-1994 or not.  Isn’t it time for the US to look at those incidents differently and now begin to know more about the Somalis instead of associating everybody including Somalilanders with what had happened in Mogadisho more than six years ago?

 

A- I think that is a very good question and comment both, I agree with you. But I would say it’s not Somalia that the United States needs to learn more about. We infact need to learn more about much of the world. Right now we seem to be lecturing to the rest of the world, telling them What to do in our way.  Part of the problem that emerged in Somalia somewhere in 1993 was the fact that we were trying to impose a US style government upon Somalis.  Some of ‘em didn’t like it. Rather work things out together, which is what we were doing in the beginning, we seemed to be saying “this is the way it has to be done’. That produced resentment which in turn produced full little conflict which developed to full military conflict. It wasn’t all one side. You are right the Americans don’t seem to understand that very well. But it was a great embarrassment obviously to President Clinton early in his administration. However our elections are coming in November. President Clinton will be retiring and I think at that stage there is gonna be a lot of  rethinking not just about Somalia but about the entire world.

We have to think about it much more carefully than we have been doing recently. So not only Somaliland was involved but most Somalis were not involved in what happened by accident if you will; by a series of mistakes on both sides which ended up with the United States and the UN fighting against not just one group of Somalis.

Somalis have a reputation that if they are attacked from the outside they all come together. While I was here as Ambassador from  1982 to 1984, Ethiopians made a mistake. They thought Siyad Barre was weak when they as you might recall they invaded some parts of Somalia (areas in central Somalia and further to the south). But then everybody come together behind Siyad Barre. It is something again we can not understand. So Eideed was popular but when he was attacked by the US and the UN he became much more popular.

Q- Though democracy is thriving in Somaliland, however people may not be able to practise it fully due to institutional constraints. Is there a possibility for American organizations to provide support to Somaliland government institutions and civil society groups in terms of capacity building to enable them play a more effective role in deepening democratic practices in this country?

A- Yes, one can do that. At the same time you have to remember the United States is going to be very careful about the opinion of the AOU. We are not going to, as a government, promote the independence of Somaliland.

But yet the internal process in Somaliland is important and I think there is room for help and I promised the President when I got back I’m gonna see what I can do to get some assistance for you in those areas. Because if you put assistance in those areas to the same sort of good use you already put in other areas, it won’t take much.

May be you will be able to find some people who come out to give you some help. But I think what you are doing on your own is much more important.

It will be your process not some one else’s process. During the early days of UNITAF I would always say to local leaders ‘we need to have some authority that we can work with on humanitarian as well as security affairs.

You decide what you want and do it any way you want, be it the traditional way or by vote---you can do it by consulting the Islamic or Clan leaders-- any way you want except you can’t do it by guns any more. I had a big fight with Eideed when he complained that at certain places his governors no longer have any respect (unless they use guns). I said to him the only reason they had any respect was because of the guns and as they became unable to use their guns any more, people had thrown them (the governors) out. I reminded him that guns can no longer be used to impose political will; and that he had to find another way. I pointed out that some of other governors were still there because they were working with the people while those who had been working against the people were gone. And I think what you have here in Somaliland is clearly the outcome of a Somali style meetings that lasted 4-6 months that produced a natural consesus. Sometimes I wish we had something like that in the United States.

Q- As a long time observer of Somali affairs how would you assess the current Djibouti conference which is being held in a backdrop of previous failed attempts to resolve the Somalia crises.

A- I don’t know what is going on in Djibouti but seeing so many of the same old people, I would be surprised if youth get any thing but the same old solutions.

 And even if you have something on paper, that doesn’t mean it is going to happen. Though it’s true to some degree in the US as well but I noticed in Somalia over the many years that something on paper doesn’t necessarily mean it is actually going to happen.

We had this big conference in Lusaka about the Congo, a year ago. They signed all sort of things but nothing has happened. But in Somaliland you can see a lot of progress because things are not talked or written about but you see them happen. That makes it very impressive. If we can see something like that in the South I think everybody will be happy.

I would be surprised but I will be happy if this came out of the conference in Djibouti.

Q- Siyad Barre’s former military officers have been assigned by the Djibouti conference to formulate and implement a disarmament of Somali’s armed militia.   Do you think is it a realistic move and what is the chances of its success?

A- Very frankly I can’t imagine a commission for disarmament run by Gaani. It’s an impossible task. Certainly no one in this part of the country would like to have any thing to do with it. This is not a diplomatic answer but that is what I feel very strongly.

 

Q- After your visit here, do you think Somaliland deserves to receive much more assistance from other countries such as the US?

A. I think Somaliland deserves more assistance from the US and others because it puts the very small amount of assistance it is getting today to a very very good use. That is what impressed me. The IRC has small business projects such as providing loans through revolving funds and giving small business training. And you see people trained going to work and making a living for themselves and no longer relying on assistance. I have seen what you have done in rebuilding the city of Hargeisa in the last 2 years have been astonishing.  Bearing in mind that it is only 3 years since you have achieved true peace following the Hargeisa conference of 1996-1997, however what has happened since that time with limited assistance is amazing. You compare that to other countries in Africa and even other places in Somalia you got a huge amount of assistance and nothing has come out of it. So I think that Somaliland certainly deserves more assistance.

Q. In that case  are you going to increase the IRC budget for activities in Somaliland?

A. I can’t make that decision but I think they would be sympathetic toward doing more. At the same time we will do what we can, to convince others to do more. I think the successes so far achieved in Somaliland would justify our applying to the US government and charity institutions for more grants. So there is a good chance for more activities here. But the executives back in New-York will have to make the decisions.

 

Q- A lot of people in Somaliland are worried that the growing interventionist nature of the Djibouti-led conference on Somalia will destabilize Somaliland. What is your opinion about this conference?

 

A- I think the objective of this conference is not to make trouble for Somaliland. And I don’t think from what I have seen in my talks with President Egal, his vice-president and his foreign Minister and others last night that they would be able to make trouble for Somaliland. Even if they tried I think that Somaliland has its own self-identity. I think it has learned the difficulties that arise from getting involved in other peoples affairs. So I believe Somaliland will be very very resistant to other becoming involved in their affairs. Now what is going to happen in the south I don’t know. I haven’t participated in the conference and didn’t come for that reason. But I saw some of the old politicians in the lobby of an expensive hotel. We were staying in a cheaper hotel. But it seemed to me that nothing has changed. So I would be surprised to myself if something came out of the conference. I think President Egal has a very correct opinion about how to deal with the situation; let us see if they can sort it out at which point we can sit down and talk to them. It sounds to me like Puntland has a similar approach. May there they will catch up with Somaliland. You are setting a good example for them and for other African countries as well, I think there is going to be more autonomy in other African countries like the Congo which I visited last year. The same thing for Sudan if they stop fighting.

I think the example set by Somaliland in this case need to be assisted and studied. Any way what I have been told by people who attended the Djibouti conference, I will be amazed if something came out of it like you have your conferences in Borama and elsewhere. I think this one is not going to be like that. It is like the usual conferences where people go to hotels and have a wonderful time and then it’s over. One hopes it is not that. One hopes that there is something coming out of it because that will be good for everybody. But I donít think from your point of view you have anything to worry about.

Q Going back a bit to the role you played in the UNITAF (International task force), there are those who still criticize you for not taking the decision to forcibly disarm Somalia’s armed militia then while there are those who commend you for opting to seek voluntary disarmament. Do you have any regrets over your decision?

 

What I Regret about disarmament is that the UN refused the proposal which we in UNITAF together with all the faction leaders made to them with a signed agreement for a voluntary disarmament. It wouldn’t have been easy or fast but we met together at the first conference in Adis. We worked out a very detailed plan for voluntary disarmament.

I don’t think that any Somali would accept the idea of someone coming in from another country and forcibly taking his weapon away. That is not the way the Somalis behave. So the idea which some had like Butros Ghali saying go there and by force of arms take their weapons away from them wouldn’t have worked. What we said was we would get the process of disarmament started with the assumption that the UN would soon bring in command.

Therefore we could start the disarmament only if the UN agreed to continue the process. But the answer that came back from New-York was no. So the programme never got started. It wouldn’t have been easy. Some factions would have tried to cheat. But at least we could have gotten it started on voluntary basis. That  is the thing I regret most about the disarmament.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

“Dadka Shirka Djibouti ka qayb-gelayaa...ma aha kuwii natiijo loo aayo soo saari lahaa”

Waraysi, Robert Oakley.

argeysa (Jam)- Ambassador Robert B. Oakley oo sannadihii 82-84 ahaa Danjire Maraykanka u fadhiya Muqdisho, isla markaana hormuud u ahaa hawlgalkii ciidamada Maraykanku ku soo farogeliyey Soomaaliya ka dib burburkii dowladdii Siyaad Barre December 1992kii, ayaa booqasho ku jooga caasimadda Somaliland ee Hargeysa, isaga oo horkacaya wefdi ballaadhan oo ka socda hay’adda Maraykanka ah ee IRC (International Rescue Committee) xarunteeda New York, oo dalka yimid Isniintii dorraad July 17.

Robert Oakley oo ka hawlgabay shaqada diblomaasiyadda iyo siyaasadda, waxa uu hadda talo-qabeen u yahay mac-hadka daraasadaha Qaranka ee istiraatijiyadda Maraykanka (Institute for National Strategic Studies) oo ka tirsan Jaamacadda Difaaca Qaranka, halkaas oo uu muxaadarooyin ka akhriyo, isla markaana waxa uu xubin ka yahay golaha sare ee agaasinka ee Hay’adda samofalka caalamiga ah ee IRC (International Rescue Committee) oo xarunteedu tahay dalka Maraykanka, oo ka hawlgalaysay Somaliland muddo lix sano ah iyada oo wax ka qabata dhinacyada beeraha, amaahda haweenka la siiyo iyo maal-gelinta meheradaha yaryar, sida uu sheegay madaxa xafiiska IRC ee Hargeysa Mr. David.

Hase yeeshee, Robert Oakley waraysi khaas ah oo uu shalay siiyey wargeysyada madaxa-bannaan ee Jamhuuriya iyo toddobaadlaha The Republican, waxa uu ka dayriyey natiijo ka soo baxda shirka Djibouti marti-geliyey oo uu ku tilmaamay mid marin habaabay, isla markaana waxa uu taageeray mowqifka xukuumadda Somaliland iyo qaabkii ay ku dhisantay Somaliland.

Waraysigaas waxa kale oo uu kaga jawaabay su’aalo la xidhiidha waayo-aragnimadii uu kala kulmay hawlgalkii uu horseedka u ahaa ee ciidamada Maraykanku ku yimaadeen Soomaaliya December 1992kii, si ay u badbaadiyaan boqolaal kun oo Soomaali ah oo macaluul u le’anayey, xurguf hawlgalkaas ka dhalatay oo dhex martay isaga (Oakley) iyo Xoghayihii hore ee Qaramada Midoobay Boutros Ghali, iyo weliba qorshaha waxqabad ee dalkiisu ugu talo-galay Somaliland, waxana uu waraysigaasi u dhacay sidan:

S/. Haddii aad xogogaal u noqotay duruufaha ka jira Somaliland ma u aragtaa in dalkani mudan yahay in caalamku, gaar ahaan Maraykanku kordhiyo kaalmada uu siiyo Somaliland? Mase ugu baaqaysaa dowladda Maraykanka noqodkaaga?

J/. Haa, waxaan qabaa in Somaliland ay hesho kaalmo intan ka badan, waayo, waxay si fiican u maamulataa qaddarka yar ee hadda la siiyo, waana arrin aan aad ugu qushuucay. Hay’adda IRC oo kale waxay maalgelisaa mashaariic yaryar oo u badan kuwa dadku quutal-daruuriga kala soo baxaan, iyada oo isla markaana tabobarro xirfadeed siisa dadka si ay iskood ugu xoogsadaan, waana wax dad loogu bogo oo la yaab leh, dib-u-dhiska ka muuqda magaalada Hargeysa labadii sano ee u dambeeyay, waxana cajiib ah in dadku iyaga oo saddexdii sano ee u dambeeyey laga soo bilaabo shirkii Hargeysa 1997, muddadaa uu nabad taam ah haystay ay haddana durba wax badani u qabsoomeen, waxa ay qabsadeenna uu yahay wax lala yaabo, iyada oo kaalmada ay heleen ay tahay wax yar, marka la barbar dhigo kaalmada faraha badan ee la siiyo waddamo badan oo Afrika ku yaalla ama Soomaaliyada kale, kuwaas oo aanay ka muuqan natiijada Somaliland ay gaadhay oo kale. Sidaas darteed, waxaan aaminsanahay in Somaliland sidan si ka ballaadhan loo caawiyo.

S/. Miisaaniyadda Somaliland ay kaga hawlgasho hay’adda IRC waa mid aad u yar ama weyd ah marka la barbar dhigo mashaariicda ballaadhan ee hay’addaasi ka waddo dalalka kale ee mandaqadda sida Koonfurta Suudaan, markaa ma ku talo jirtaan in aad kordhisaan kharashka loo qoondeeyey Somaliland?

J/. Anigu keli ahaantay go’aan kama gaadhi karo, laakiin waxaan qabaa in hay’addu qadderin iyo tixgelin siin doonto sidii loo ballaadhin lahaa hawlaheeda ay ka waddo halkan. Sidoo kale, waxaanu ku dedaali doonaa sidii aanu deeq-bixiyayaal kale aan ugu qancin lahayn in ay ka qayb-qaataan hawlaha samofalka ah ee Somaliland waxaanna u arkaa in waxyaabaha u qabsoomay Somaliland ay soo jiidaan doonto, kuna dhiirrigelin doonto hay’adda IRC in ay kaalmo dheeraad ah ka codsato hay’adaha na maalgeliya sida dowladda Maraykanka iyo deeq-bixiyayaasha kale. Waxa noo muuqda fursado wanaagsan in wax badan halkan aannu ka qabanno, balse go’aaminta arrimaha waxa iska leh golaha agaasinka sare ee hay’adda oo hadda waxba faahfaahin ah kama bixin karo.

S/. Dad badan oo reer Somaliland ahi waxay werwer ka qabaan khatar ku lid ah xasilloonida oo kaga soo fool leh faro-gelinta shirka Djibouti, maadaama aad xogogaal u tahay mandaqadda iyo arrimaha Soomaliya sidee u aragtaa shirkaas?

J/. Waxaan u malaynayaa in aanay ujeeddada shirku ahayn in uu dhibaatooyin ka abuuro Somaliland, laakiin sida iiga muuqatay wada-hadalladii aan xalay (habeen hore) la yeeshay Madaxweynaha, Madaxweyne-ku-xigeenka, Wasiirka Arrimaha Dibedda in xitaa haddii uu shirku isku dayo in uu carqaladeeyo Somaliland aanay waxba uga suurogelayn. Somaliland waxay iskeed isu taagtay meeqaan lagu garto, sida ay Somaliland u baratay dhibaatooyinka ka iman kara haddii ay cid kale farogeliso ayay si adag uga hor iman doonaan wixii farogelin ah ee cid kale kaga timaadda. Ma garan karo waxa ka dhici doona koonfurta, balse haddii aan soo maray Djibouti oo aan halkaa ku arkay siyaasiyiintii hore oo hoganaya hudheelada qaaliga ah ee Djibouti (Annagu waxaannu ku jirney kuwo kiradoodu ka jaban tahay kuwaa), waxay ila tahay in weli jidkii hore (ee lagu fashilmay) la hayo oo aan wax isbedelay jirin. Kolkaa ma filayo in halkaas wax midhadhalaa ka soo baxayaan. Waxaan qabaa in Madaxweyne Cigaal ku saxan yahay mowqifka uu ka taagan yahay arrintan ee ah “bal aan eegno in ay arrimahooda marka hore xalishaan, si aannu markaas u wada fadhiisanno oo u wada-hadalno (kooxaha Soomaaliya).”

Dhinaca Puntland waxay iyagana iila muuqataa in ay kaga dayanayaan Somaliland jidka ay jeexday oo tusaale u noqon kara waddamo badan oo Afrikaan ah. Waddamo Afrikaan ah oo aan kol hore soo maray sida Kongo waxaan qabaa in mushaakilkooda lagu xallin karo ismaamullo kala madax bannaan. Suudaan oo kale ayaa iyaduna uu suurtogal ka yahay nidaamkan oo kale haddii la soo afjaro dagaalada muddada dheer ka socday koonfurta Suudaan, waxaan qabaa in aad hirgeliseen nidaam mudan in la taageero, isla markaana la derso.

Shirkanina wuu ka duwan yahay shirarkii Somaliland hore u soo qabsatay sidii kii Boorama. Dadka shirkaas ka qayb-galayaana sida la ii sheegay ma aha kuwii natiijo loo aayo soo saari lahaa. Sidaas darteed, shirkani kama duwana kuwii hore ee dadka ka qayb-gelayaa ay ujeeddadoodu ku ekayd hudheello waaweyn oo ay seexdaan iyo in ay raaxaystaan. Runtii waxaan jeclaan lahaa in shirku noqdo mid guul wax-ku-ool ah oo cid walba u cuntanta uu ku dhammaado, waayo taasay faa’iido cid walba ugu jirtaa, waxaan jeclaan lahaa in ay wax u qabsadaan sidii aad wax u qabsateen, laakiin ma arko. Sida aad idinkuba qabtaanna meesha ma taalo wax aad ka werwertaan.

S/. Haddii aan dib u jaleecno December 1992kii iyo hawlgalkii rajo-soo-celinta Soomaaliya (Operation Restore hope) ee aad gogol-dhiggiisa lahayd, waxa jira laba ra’yi oo mid kugu dhallinayo in aad xoog u adeegsan weyday hub-ka-dhigista malleeshiyadii Soomaaliya ee hubaysnayd, ra’yiga kalena kugu ammaanayo go’aankii aad ku diiday in malleeshiyooyinka xoog hubka lagaga dhigo, imminka siddeed sano ka dib ma qoomamaynaysaa go’aankaas?

J/. Waxa keliya oo qoomamo leh sidii Qaramada Midoobay ay gaashaanka ugu dhufteen soo-jeedintayadii annaga oo UNITAF (United Nations International Task Force ee Maraykanku hoggaaminayey), dhammaan hoggaamiyayaasha kooxuhuna nala ogolaadeen ee ahayd in malleeshiyooyinka ikhtiyaarkooda hubka isaga dhigaan, soo-jeedintaas oo si faahfaahsan loo diyaariyey ka dib shirkii u horreeyey ee arrimaha Soomaaliya ee lagu qabtay Addis Ababa ayaa loo soo bandhigay Qaramada Midoobay, sidaan ognahayna ma jiro qof Soomaali ah oo ogolaan kara in cid shisheeye ah oo meel kale ka soo duushay ay khasab hubka kaga dhigto oo waxay ka soo hor jeeddaa dhaqanka Soomaalida. Mana qabo in fikraddii Buotros Ghali oo kale ee ahayd halkaa gal oo dadkaa hubka qasab kaga dhig in ay shaqayn lahayd. Qorshuhuna wuxuu ahaa in aanu annagu daadahayno geeddi-socodka hub-ka-dhigista, dhammaystirkeedana ay yeelato Qaramada Midoobay (UNISOM II), balse markii xarunta Qaramada Midoobay ee New York aannu weydiisanay in ay hawsha nagala wareegaan waxay jawaabtoodii noqotay “Maya”. Sidaas darteed, ayaan barnaamijkii loo bilaabin oo u baaqday iyada oo aan aaminsanahay hadduu mar uun bilaabmi lahaa dhibaato kastaa ha jirtee in natiijo laga gaadhi lahaa maadaama soo-jeedintayadu ay ku salaysnayd in dadku ku qancaan in iskood ay hubka isaga dhigaan, haddii ay jirto wax aan ka xumaadaa waa arrintaas hub-ka-dhigista.

S/. Calool-xumadii dadka iyo dowladda Maraykanku ka qaadeen waxyaabihii Xamar kaga dhacay wakhtigii UNOSOM-ta ayaa la moodaa in aanay weli ka bixin oo ay Soomaali oo dhan u hayaan xataa Somaliland, ma kula tahay in la gaadhay wakhtigii arrintaas ay Maraykanku ka bogsan lahaayeen?

J/. Waxaan u malaynayaa taasi in ay tahay su’aal wanaagsan, oo mudan in laga hadlo mar kasta, waanan kugu raacsanahay; laakiin waxaan odhan lahaa ma aha Soomaaliya oo keliya meelaha Maraykanku u baahan yahay in uu wax badan ka ogaado ama ka barto. Xaqiiqatan waxa aanu u baahanahay in aanu aad u barano adduunka badankiisa. Wakhtigan xaadirka ah waxaan u muuqanaa (USA) in aanu muxaadaro u jeedinayno adduunka intiisa kale, annaga oo u sheegayna waxa ay samaynayaan, sida ay annaga nala tahay uun. Qayb ka mid ah dhibaatadii ka dhacday meelo ka mid ah Soomaaliya, sannadkii 1993kii, waxay ahayd xaqiiqo in ay keentay ama sababtay isku daygii ahaa in aanu Soomaaliya dusha kaga keeno dowlad qaabka Maraykanka ah. Qaar ka mid ahi ma aanay jeclaysanin halkii aanu markii hore hawshu noogu bilaabmatay wada shaqayn, waxa aanu isku rognay oo aanu u muuqanay kuwa leh (sidan iyo sidan ayaa wax loo sameeyaa), taasina waxa ay dhashay cadho iyo nacayb, isu rogay ka dib, waxoogaa iska horimaadyo ah kaas oo markii danbe noqday iska horimaad buuxa oo milateri.

Ma ahayn mid eedeeda oo dhan uu leeyahay dhinac keliya. Waad saxan tahay oo Ameerikaanku waxa ay u muuqdaan kuwo aan arrinta si fiican u fahamsanayn, laakiin waa caddaan in ay weji-gabax weyn ku ahayd baryihii u horraysay maamulka Clinton. Si kastaba ha ahaatee, doorashooyinkayagii guud waxa ay dhacayaan bisha Noofambar ee soo socota, Madaxweyne Bill Clinton-na wuxuu geli doonaa hawlgab, waxaanan filayaa in marxaladan cusub ee la galayaa ay noqon doonto mid wax badan dib looga fekero, ma aha Soomaaliya arrinteeda oo keliya, laakiin adduunka oo dhan. Waa in aanu si aad ah oo aad uga taxadar badan sidii hore uga fakarno arrintaa.

Somaliland oo keliya ma aha ee Soomaalida badideeduba kuma lug lahayn shilkii dhacay oo ahaa mid ka dhashay qaladaad taxane ah oo labada dhinacba ka dhacay, kaas oo natiijadiisu noqotay dagaal ay iskaga hor yimaadeen Maraykanka iyo Qaramada Midoobay oo dhinac ah iyo Soomaali oo aan ahayn markaa hal koox oo keliya. Soomaalidu sumcad bay ku leeyihiin haddii dibada laga soo weeraro oo dhammaantood way ku midoobaan oo way iskugu tagaan. Wakhtigii aan halkan (Soomaaliya) joogay ee aan safiirka ahaa 1982kii ilaa 84kii, waxa jirtay Itoobiyaanku in ay sameeyeen khalad oo ay u maleeyeen in Siyaad Barre wiiqmay, markaasna haddii aad xusuusato ay soo galeen qaybo ka mid ah Soomaaliya (jiidda gobollada dhexe iyo koonfurta sida Goldogob iyo Balanbale) ka dib na Soomaali oo dhami intay isku timid ay taageertay Siyaad Barre, tani waxay ahayd arrin aanaan fahamsanayn. Sidaa darteed, Caydiid oo markiisii horeba caan ahaa markii ay weerareen ciidamada Maraykanka iyo Qaramada Midoobay, wuu sii caan baxay uun.

S/. Somaliland waxa ka jirta dimuqraadiyad, laakiin in ay si buuxda u taabo-geliso uguna dhaqanto waxa hor taagan inkaaniyaad dhinaca farsamo iyo dhaqaalaha ah, markaa Somaliland ma ka heli kartaa hay’adaha Maraykanka ee u ololeeya dimuqraadiyadda in ay ka daboolaan baahidaa?

J/. Haa, mid wuu samayn karaa, hase yeeshee, waa in aad maskaxda ku haysaa in Maraykanku uu aad uga taxadirayo mowqifka ururka Midowga Afrika (OAU). Annagu ma doonayno dowlad ahaan in aanu noqono kuwo u ololaynaya madax-bannaanida Somaliland, laakiin haddana geeddi socodka gudaha ee Somaliland waa mid muhiim ah, waxaanan qabaa in uu jaanis ka bannaan yahay caawinteeda, aniguna waxaan u ballanqaaday Madaxweynaha in marka aan noqdo aan eego wixii aan arrintaa ka qaban karo. Haddii kaalmo la geliyo meelahaas, oo si fiican looga faa’iidaysto, meelo kalena waad gelinaysaa, wax badana ma qaadanayso oo waxa laga yaabaa in dad kalena ku soo dhiiradaan in ay caawimo ku siiyaan, balse waxaan qabaa, waxa aad adigu qabsatay uun in ay aad uga muhiimsan yihiin. Maalmihii ugu horreeyay hawlgalkii UNITAF waxaan ku odhan jiray hoggaamiyayaasha degaanka: “Waxaanu u baahanahay in aanu helno maamul aanu ka wada-shaqayn karno hawlaha aadaminimo iyo weliba nabadgelyada...” adigu waxa aad go’aansan kartaa waxa aad doonayso waxaanad u samaysan kartaa qaabka aad doonto ha noqoto hab dhan ama doorasho qof kastaa codkiisa dhiibanayo...Waad samayn kartaa adiga oo la tashanaya culimada iyo hoggaamiyeyaasha beelaha...Jidka aad adigu rabto keliya, kumana gaadhi kartid qor, haba yaraatee. Anigu dagaal weyn baa na dhex maray Caydiid, markii uu ka cawday in meelaha qaarkood mas’uuliyiintii u joogtay aan haba yaraatee tixgelin la siinin (ilaa ay isticmaaleen). Waxaan ku idhi isaga (Caydiid) sababta keliya ee lagu tixgeliyay waxay ahayd hubka ay haysteen oo haddii aanay awoodi karayn in ay isticmaalaan hubkooda, dadku way iska ridi lahaayeen (Badhasaabada) balse waxaan xusuusiyay in hubka aan wakhti dheer lagu sii isticmaali karin in lagu khasbo rabitaanka siyaasadeed, isla markaana uu raadiyo dariiq kale in uu helo. Waxa aan u tilmaamay in qaar kale oo hoggaamiyeyaasha ka mid ahi ay weli halkaa ka jiraan, sababtuna waxa weeye waxay wada-shaqayn yeesheen dadkooda, halka kuwii dadka ku lidka ahaa ay socdeen ama iska tageen, waxaanan qabaa in waxa aad halkan ka samaysateen (Somaliland) ay tahay midhihii shirarkii dhaqan ee Soomaalida, kuwaas oo socday 4-6 bilood, uuna ka soo baxay tashi iyo wada-xaajood dhaqan. Mararka qaarkood waxaan is idhaahdaa taas oo kale miyay Maraykanka dhexdiisa ka jirto.

S/. Marka aad ka duusho khibrada aad u leedahay arrimaha Soomaaliya, sidee buu kuula muuqdaa shirka hadda ka socda waddanka Djibouti, sideese aad u aragtaa in lagu xallin doono mushkiladda Soomaaliya?

J/. Anigu ma garanayo waxa ka soconaya Djibouti, laakiin marka aan arkay dadkii hore uun oo meesha jooga, isma lihi waxa ka soo bixi wax ka duwan wixii hore uun, haddii xitaa wax warqad dusheed lagu xarxariiqo, taas macnaheedu ma aha in wixii sideeda u soconayaan inkasta oo taas oo kale ay ka dhacdo Maraykanka laftiisa, laakiin waxaan sheegay sannado badan oo aan ku jiray arrimaha Soomaaliya in wax warqad lagu qoray aanay macnaheedu ahayn in ay fulayso, tan waxaan uga soo taagnaa shir weyn oo lagu qabtay Lunsaca, oo lagaga hadlayey arrimaha Koongo sannad ka hor, dhinacyada oo dhami way saxeexeen wax kasta laakiin waxba kamay suurogelin.

Marka la eego Somaliland waxaad arki kartaa horumarka ay gaadhay sababta oo ah arrimuhu may ahayn kuwo laga wada-hadlay ama la qoray uun, laakiin waxa aad aragtaa in ay fuleen taas oo samaysay wax aad loogu qushuuco, haddaynu tan oo kale ku arki lahayn koonfurta waxay ila tahay in qof kastaaba ku farxi lahaa, mucjiso ayay noqon lahayd, waanan ku farxi hadday tani ka soo baxdo shirka Djibouti.

S/. Saraakiishii milateri ee Siyaad Barre ayuu shirka Djibouti u xil saaray fulinta iyo dejinta qorshaha hubka dhigista malleeshiyada Soomaaliya, ma kuula muuqataa mid midho-dhalin karta?

J/. Maya, waxa ay la mid tahay adiga oo madbakha ku xidha bisad. Marka aan si saraaxi ah u hadlo, ma filayo guddi hub-ka-dhigis oo uu hoggaaminayo Jnl Gaani, waa hawl aan suurtogal ahayn. Sida cad ma jiro qof ka mid ah gobolkan oo ay taasi khusaysaa, ma aha tani jawaab diblomaasi ah, laakiin waa wax aan si weyn uga dareen qabo.